Well July is it, im off to the army. So starting from July you wont be seeing me that often as ill be doing push ups, sit ups and ridiculous amount of running in the army. I am already exercising every morning and go to gym on monday and wednesday and running of tuesday and thursday.

When i went to do all the tests of physical and mental examination there was this one test that was supposed to show what position i am most suited for. I got a good laugh out of that one. There were lots of rows of words in 4 columns so i was supposed to pick one that describes me best and one that describes me least for each row. Just to give you an example how ridiculous the test was there was courageous on one of the rows. So i asked the lady sitting opposite me what it means, is it like im willing to take risks and responsibility or is it like Braveheart courageous where i run up to the enemy and hack them up with a sword or an axe. Anyway it turned out that id be either a good driver or a squad leader. hah .

I didn't know Estonia had conscription. You probably had to go now you finished your studies right? For about a year? That's usually the standard service time.

They abolished it in Belgium about 10 years ago. Not complaining. Anyway, hope you make the best of it, and try not to get caught in FF! Shouldn't be too hard without me or Derf around.

Yep its around 8-12 months depending on some factors.

Cool. Is it mandatory conscription? Italy still has its conscription program but it's voluntary.

Driver or squad leader? lol. Those initial "who am I?" tests are more for people who need an idea of what they could be, for the sake of direction more than anything. Do you have an idea of what kind of trade training you're gonna go for? Or are you open minded?

As for preparing beforehand, good man! I was starting that off a while ago before choosing my civvy job... just for the sake of it really. No point turning up as a physical mess.

Yea, getting in shape before is a good move. Before I went in I did some pushups, but wish I'd done a lot more running and push-ups. Basic training kicked my butt... I put on like 20 lbs, mostly mostly, in 2 months.

Anyway, enjoy yourself.

I know that a lot of places, UK included, view this as a bad thing.

But I think it should be mandatory. It'd sort out immigration problems (somewhat) and people would have a lot more respect for this country. It'd mean that for at least 1 - 2 years of peoples lives they'd all be earning the same wage (From Fatcat to tomcat) and to be honest I know it'd kill me; but I'd come out better for it.

heh...except for that 5-10% that fail hard. I remember the loser brigade from my basic training. Maybe we could just deport those people to Haiti or Cuba or something.

I don't think it should be mandatory. Not everyone is up to it. In Italy they used to give you the option to choose some kind of community service. I know a guy who was a pastoro (dont know the english word) in the mountains and I wouldn't exactly say he had it better off. He sure as heck had to work his ass off.

Other than that, i'm sure there are many social and economic factors to consider the pros and cons.

Part of me agrees with the Starship Troopers idea of everyone having to serve a term of military service in order to become a citizen. And only citizens can vote, get licenses to make babies , run for office, etc.

The other half of me realizes that not everyone should be in the military, and forcing everyone into the military will not increase the worth of everyone, it'll only decrease the worth of the military. An idea of a civil alternative to military service (like Derf mentions) is an interesting alternative.

Living in Texas, there are so many people that have no appreciation for what being a US citizen means. Not saying that being a citizen of Belgium or England or whatever is any less meaningful, but people that partake of what the country has to offer without giving anything back annoys me. I may not be the most patriotic person in the world, but I do pay taxes and I did do the military thing. The military thing was for my own benefit, but it gave me an appreciation for freedom that most people don't have.

I'm pretty un-nationalist compared to Satis then. My interpretation of nationalism is that (contrary to what seems to be the message) the state primarily protects its own interests whereas the people, as an entity, are secondary. Therefore I see citizenship as a misplaced concept.

In my view, military service is something personal like any other job. If you enjoy a very tough but adventurous lifestyle, then the armed forces are for you.

Same here. The Army is as much a branch of public services as, say, the department of mobility and as such I don't believe it should be coupled to any measure of citizenship. And yes, it's not quite the same as the other public service branches in its command structure and what it does, but in the end that's what it is: it's funded by taxpayer money to provide a state service (protection) to citizens.

I think most people here tend to think that I see the army as some sort of superdevil, and I wouldn't blame them based on some of my statements here. But I've actually considered the military once or twice. But not as a soldier involved in actual warfare, heck no. You get paid more as a non-fighting specialist than a grunt who has an infinitely larger chance of getting killed, so only an insane person or one with no other skills would choose that as an active career. Seriously.

Anyways, on alternative service: Israel is pretty big on this. And it has mandatory military service for women, too! Satis' vision is getting nearer.

I wouldn't consider Israel an ideal example. Their existence pretty much hinges on a powerful military. Though some of those Israeli chick soldiers are HAWT

Not so. Pay is based primarily on time served and rank regardless of regiment / corps.

Yes, i'm (derf) posting as Guest today cos i can't be arsed to login

So someone offering a rare, specialised skill (interpreters, different sorts of engineers, doctors) gets the same pay as a grunt who barely passes the IQ entry test? That doesn't make sense. Why would anyone above high school education ever enter the army apart from having them pay their studies?

I don't know about you guys, but I'm kind of particular at distinguishing myself from the manmonkeys of this world.